Wednesday, June 9, 2010
John v. Steven
I'm proud of these two students. Both came up prepared and shined. This debate was so close that only a slip up by Steven allowed the judges to vote towards a particular debater. How is it possible that men are not equal (john's assertion) when all are equal in God's eyes (Steven's slip up)? The rebuttal could have been a great place for steven to address this issue. Science also seems to haunt our abolish side. Prove that they are men, don't just say they physically look alike. That was not enough back then it is not working now. Kenny did a decent job suggesting that animals can't learn/practice religion but what if these "animals" could?
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john and Steven both had excellent points. iBelieve Steven would've absolutely won if he would've brung the scientific argument again, in his rebuttal. John kindaa contradicted himself because he said they are not educated, but they can still work. And Steve could've said Dockworkers arn't doctors and lawyers, and the job really isn't that important of successful. But iVoted for Steve, because he brung up the scientific theory, which really isn't used that recently, But iWould've liked his rebuttal more, if he would've added a bible statement, in either his original speech, or his rebuttal, so as many points would'nt have been crossed out. Hmmm, the Steve's cross examination, was mostly controlled by John because every question Steve had, John answered, But Steve really didn't know what to say, so he just continued on to the next question. This is why iBelieve Steve's cross examination was weak. iLoved john's cross examination because he got Steve to admit that God is correct when God says in the bible that all men are created equal. Overall, Congradulations to both debaters.! iEnjoyed watching this debate, and iWas surprised when the judges didn't know who to pick...
ReplyDeleteI think John is right because slavery should be abolished. We can all do the same job. We are equal. But Steven said all men are not equal so why can we do the same job. They are the back bone. We all have different classic.
ReplyDeleteI think they both did a good job. I like John's CX he got Steve to agree we all equal in god's eye. John answer every questions that Steve asked. But John's rebuttal was litter weaker than Steve. Congrats to both debaters.
ReplyDeleteI think they both did a good job but i strongly think that john should have won the debate but it is just a opinion I felt like john should have won because i believe he had more evidence in his speech and he also made steve amit to somethig in his cx
ReplyDeletei belive that steven won and good job to him and to what Rachel said that "contradicted himself because he said they are not educated, but they can still work. And Steve could've said Dockworkers arn't doctors and lawyers, and the job really isn't that important of successful" i said that they where uneducated but the point is thar white men still held the same jobs as i did
ReplyDeleteI think that John & Steve did a good job today. they both had alot of evidence and good points, i like johns opening arguement. but steve did really good in the cx .both debater did a good job today :)
ReplyDeleteto address john, i think you did a really good job overall! i love how you got steve to admit we are all equal(in god's eyes) i also liked your one argument i cant rememeber off the top of my head, but i know it was your second one and i liked it. i also like how you handled yourself really well during the CX. But the fact that you said they are uneducated but they still had jobs contradited yourself. and due to lack of evidence in your rebuttal, i voted for steve. Also, i think you could have used more evidence throughout your speech. i counted 4 pieces, unless there was more i dont know, but steve had like 9. but anyway onto steve. i loved your rebuttal, it was strong, although i have to admit something i wanted you to do was have something to counter the bible statement john brought up, then you would have had a unanimous vote. Also, i like how you had a lot of evidence throughout your speech, and in the rebuttal, and countered john in the CX when you made his contradiction stand out with the jobs vs. education. overall, this was a great debate to watch good job to both of you guys.
ReplyDeleteI believe this debate should have gone to Finley.Steves' opening arguments used more evidence however Finley controlled both CXs. Although Gibbs asked how are they equeal if whites can read, John should have said Negros clearly have the ability to learn, yet very often get the opportunity to, however knowledge in literature doesn't always make one smart. This was a fun one. Congradulations Steve.
ReplyDeleteI think the both did a good job there opening arguments were excellent john did nice with his all man are equal argument and back it up with saying when all are equal in God's eyes also i liked Steve scientific argument he did good i think he should of broth up the scientific argument in his rubuttle as a come back and he would of most likely to won but over all the two debaters did good the opening argument, CX and rubuttals were grate and congratulation to john
ReplyDeletethis was a good debate. john had a good opening state and steve had a good cx. they both did well. congrates to steve!!!
ReplyDeleteThe big part of this debate was in the cx. When it was stated that we are all equal in God's eyes. I think that was a good point brought up John. And made me think he would endly win the debate, but Great job Steve.
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ReplyDeleteYet again, this was a very food tight debate. I strongly believe that as we continue to move forward, that the debates are getting stronger and stronger. The for slavery side is really bringing the heat to the abolishment of slavery. But, abolishment good job in retaliating back. Now its a one debate difference in sides. I think that everyone can agree, that today we saw a verrrrrryyyy close debate. Steve you have three arguments. You used tons of evidence. Like pg.9, pg. 10, pg.41. Using the definition of chattel, and population charts on pages 5 and 6 I believe. This was a well planned, organized and put together opening argument. Your economy argument was superb and brilliant. You clearly proved that slave were indeed needed for economical reasons and that they just better off as slaves with protection and non-harming living conditions. John, you had some good arguments as well. You had 3 well thought-out and creative arguments. You used the more emotional side of the problem. That slaves were not inferior, not equal, and not educated. I think that I've so far never heard of those three arguments beforehand. You used the D.O.I., and page 30 showing how corrupt America's economy was becoming. You also used the occupation chart on pg.7. Witch could had been countered that the jobs that they were doing weren’t nothing at all that an average person can’t do. With the cost of slaves going up. In my mind, Steve just might had won the opening argument by the over-whelming amount of evidence that he brought to the table. Both debaters did incorporate their character’s into their speeches well though, which I’m seeing to being better and better each debate progresses each day. Steve I think you asked some real good questions in your CX. You said that if they were uneducated, how were they able to do their jobs. John then contradicted himself saying that they are, but just to the point of them doing to their jobs. John you asked some good questions as well. You asked Steve about the economy as shown on page 30. Steve had no answer. And the one main question that everyone talked about that you said,” Are we equal in the eyes of God?", you got Steve to say yes. And I think that was the hole and the opening that made my decision. In the rebuttal John used the Revolutionary War argument and the equality argument as well. I think that if you would had given some evidence to support it, it would be better and stronger. A suggestion would be Dunmare's Proclamation. Steve you had a stronger rebuttal. You not only attacked John's arguments, but re-stated yours and supplied again a lot of evidence. But one thing you could've done was beat in the scientific argument. John you could've did the same using Charles Darwin that we all came from one, Lucy!!! Overall this was a very good debate. The judges hard a very hard decision to make. It came down to one judges decision that chose the winner. But in my mind, you both were winners. You both gave excellent speeches and gave it your all. You left everything out on the table, leaving me speechless. Both debaters came prepared and knew their arguments well to give a stellar performance. This could've been anymore exciting to watch, or any closer to decide. But in the end Steve won. It was an hard fought debate that could've been any better. Congratulations to both debaters!!! I wish it didn't end this way, it was heart-breaking, but worth the win for slavery and lost against it. Nothing could be more better or juicier than this debate right here!!!!! I also liked Brian M.’s comment too. I agree with him.
ReplyDeleteThis was very very close and im glad i had the opportunity to judge this one. the one mistake if you could really call it that was the fact that john left the uneducated argument and didnt really help himself while he was trying to say were all equal. Steve couldve really punded this in and said something like well if your not educated then your not the same as someone who is educated? something as simple as that wouldve made a world of diffrence. in the rebuttals steve had alot of evidence but didnt really connect it to his arguments so it was just like stateing documents and john didnt have any evidence in his rebuttal it was just like trying to get you to feel for him but thats not what it was judged on if it was he wouldve won but we have to decide by evidence. i thought it was very good and im happy with the outcome
ReplyDeleteThen again, this was a very close debate! I have to congratulate steve for coming up there with preparation and all. He really had a great speech and evidence to go with his arguments! For John, i would like to congrats to you during the CX, you had stevee to admit that "we're all equal in the eyes of god" based on that you won the CX. and when steve twist things around on the Mudsill theory, that was good. What steve didn't do was hammered John's D.O.I argument. He could have said that it was still a document. I personally thought it was tie but looking back at it, steve had more evidence and he came back during the rebuttals, therefore. i had to give my vote to him
ReplyDeleteNice critques everyone.
ReplyDeleteI'm proud of y'all for bloggin and really understanding
the concept of slaveryy. Good luck to future debaters and
good job to ones that already debated. Oh and yeah
good luck to the debaters going against gold !!!
Letssssss go ! Lol
its a great debate, they both had a lot of evidence, Both debaters came prepared and knew their arguments. in the rebuttals steve had alot of evidence but he didn't connect it to his arguments, i liked when john used the argument
ReplyDelete"we are all equal in God's eyes", i think its a great argument.
i think both of you did good
Killer blogging!
ReplyDeleteI really liked John's arguments. They were unique in a way and really good. i liked how you got Steve to admit that all mean are equal in the eyes of God. Like others said i do think that you contradicted yourself when you said that even though they were uneducated they still worked and could do the same job as white men. Overall though i think you did a really good job. Steve i think that were really prepared and had a lot of evidence to back up your arguments. I think that you should of really got John when he talked about the jobs and how some who worked was educated and some werent because that mean that they weren't all equal. In the end both of ya'll did a good job and congrates Steve for taking the win
ReplyDeletei agree with jonese the way john got steave to admit that all men are equal . steave however i wished you would have seemed a little bit more interested. on the other hand you both seemed to present a lot of evidence to back up yor argument. john your rebuttal could use work. but overall good job and cant wait to what going to await us tomorrow
ReplyDeleteThis debate was mind blogging. As a judge, it was so difficult to choose a winner. One slip- up caused the debate to flip from one side to another. John tried to prove that all humans are the same in the eyes of God,but we abolishers need to try to figure out why are human. Possibly Charles Darwin theory. This is so hard to grasp. Steve admitted to John's question, but Steve's better off as slaves argument was amazing and was overflowing with evidence. Congrats to both players.
ReplyDeleteThis was an enjoyable debate i really liked it. I do believe that steve deserved to win however both debaters did a excellent job and had good openin statement i liked when john said that we are all the same in God's eyes. Congrats steve and john for a very interesting debate.
ReplyDeleteThis debate was interesting. Both had very good argument. I enjoyed how John said, "...in God's eyes." I believe Steve was caught after this.
ReplyDeleteI think Steve should've done better in his essay & rebuttal.
But in all and all, it was a great debate.
this debate was interesting. My favorite part was when john said to steve that "we are all equal in gods eyes" . They both used a variety of evidence to come back at each other. Congratulations to both.
ReplyDeleteWow! Wow! Wow!This debate was exciting and fun to watch. The most two quite boys of the class get up in front of the class and come forth with a well thought out speech. Congrats to both. In my eyes you both are winners. Steve i loved your rebuttal. John I loved your cx. CONGRATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ReplyDeleteThey both doing good job, they both have good argument, and I like john say we are all equal in god eyes, I like that. Also I like their cx.....they doing good job!
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